[KI-LC] Download form turned into a GPA - what do you think?

John Wunderlich john at wunderlich.ca
Wed Feb 28 23:08:59 UTC 2018


Nice summary Andrew

Thanks, John
4giv spellin errurz from mobile devize
________________________________
From: LC <lc-bounces at kantarainitiative.org> on behalf of Andrew Hughes <andrewhughes3000 at gmail.com>
Sent: Wednesday, February 28, 2018 4:59:21 PM
To: Colin Wallis
Cc: Ruth Puente; Oliver Maerz; Kantara Leadership Council
Subject: Re: [KI-LC] Download form turned into a GPA - what do you think?

As a Chair, I'd prefer to avoid giving incentive to downloaders to enter garbage data just to get the report - it's hard enough as it is to keep tabs on who is on the WG Rosters. As a downloader, I would not want to sign an agreement to get the document - I'd just abandon and go to the next hit in Google search results. If I found the material interesting, I might be interested in circling back to find out more.

Considering the thread so far, I see some potential requirements:

1) A way to measure interest in the publications (right now this is download counting)
2) Identify as many potential Kantara members as possible (right now this is the form-before-download data)
3) Reduce followup load on the pipeline of potential members
4) Reduce or remove gates to download some of the publications (e.g. Reports)
5) Clarify publication usage licensing (e.g. improve the Notices and other boilerplate text; OR inform the downloader of licensing)
6) Strengthen downloader's commitment to the IPR Policy (I don't understand this one - I see the IPR Policy as pertinent to contributions not usage license)
7) Restrict access/license for some publications to be for Members-only



Andrew Hughes CISM CISSP
In Turn Information Management Consulting

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Identity Management | IT Governance | Information Security

On Wed, Feb 28, 2018 at 12:32 PM, Colin Wallis <colin at kantarainitiative.org<mailto:colin at kantarainitiative.org>> wrote:
Ok thanks.

But please appreciate we are now at the same number of fields to fill in whether you fill out a form-before-download or GPA. Or we could make it so.
I see a person's thought process to GPA at the same level as trading off say,  terms and conditions to get something I want - an app, a service, whatever.

Cheers

On 28 Feb 2018 6:06 p.m., "Ken Dagg" <kendaggtbs at gmail.com<mailto:kendaggtbs at gmail.com>> wrote:
I agree with Andrew with respect to the more eyes that see a document the better it is for Kantara. As such, I think there will be a higher percentage of abandoned downloads if someone is forced to sign a GPA and join a group just to see a document. I agree with Andrew about the updates to documents to address the current weaknesses he has identified. To strengthen the download process I’d recommend a statement along the line of “by downloading you are agreeing to the IPR associated with this document.” A link to the IPR would need to be provided. This is similar to the thing everyone clicks when they want to download an app.

Ken



On Wed, Feb 28, 2018 at 12:34 PM Colin Wallis <colin at kantarainitiative.org<mailto:colin at kantarainitiative.org>> wrote:
So to be clear.. my suggestion is that ALL downloads sign a GPA, to in effect bind them to the IPR in a more explicit way than a notice on the docs, whose processes we are explaining more in the new version of the OPs Procs (only seen by Ken and Sal, not all Chairs yet).

I'm proposing that 'Members only' downloads is a sub set of ALL downloads.

I will respond in more detail to Sal when I'm not on the move..

Cheers
Colin

Executive Director
Cell: +44 (0)7490 266 778<tel:+44%207490%20266778>
@KantaraColin

Kantara Consent Receipt and UMA are 2 of the top 5<https://identiverse.com/2017/12/18/five-identity-trends-watch-2018/>
See Kantara's 2017 Great Work!<https://kantarainitiative.org/confluence/pages/viewpage.action?pageId=96437567>
Kantara Initiative Inc<https://kantarainitiative.org/> & Kantara Initiative, Europe
[https://drive.google.com/uc?id=0B7y8c3lrgRtUUjRFMHFMQm1BR3M&export=download]


On Wed, Feb 28, 2018 at 3:10 PM, Andrew Hughes <andrewhughes3000 at gmail.com<mailto:andrewhughes3000 at gmail.com>> wrote:
I read Colin’s note as meaning ALL downloads. The ‘members only’ part sounded separate.
On Wed, Feb 28, 2018 at 6:51 AM Salvatore D'Agostino <sal at idmachines.com<mailto:sal at idmachines.com>> wrote:
I agree on far and wide, I thought you were trying to administer something restricted.  Happy to use “your” form.

From: Andrew Hughes [mailto:andrewhughes3000 at gmail.com<mailto:andrewhughes3000 at gmail.com>]
Sent: Wednesday, February 28, 2018 9:44 AM
To: sal at idmachines.com<mailto:sal at idmachines.com>
Cc: Colin Wallis <colin at kantarainitiative.org<mailto:colin at kantarainitiative.org>>; Kantara Leadership Council <lc at kantarainitiative.org<mailto:lc at kantarainitiative.org>>; Ruth Puente <ruth at kantarainitiative.org<mailto:ruth at kantarainitiative.org>>; Oliver Maerz <oliver at kantarainitiative.org<mailto:oliver at kantarainitiative.org>>
Subject: Re: [KI-LC] Download form turned into a GPA - what do you think?

I’m not keen on this.

I think publications should be circulated far and wide - the more eyes that see them, the better.

The weak part in our pubs is a) a text describing the what and why of Kantara, b) a citation line that can be cut/pasted by someone wanting to acknowledge it in a bibliography (I have added this to the master doc template and some recent publications have it on their cover pages), c) a license statement, d) a “licensed to” watermark if PDF.

I think the form before download is a clunky but reasonable trade off (I suggested it, so blame me if you don’t like it).

Andrew.
On Wed, Feb 28, 2018 at 6:17 AM Salvatore D'Agostino <sal at idmachines.com<mailto:sal at idmachines.com>> wrote:
I think to stay clean on the IP you have to join to group and sign  its GPA.  What is the group?

(which means you have multiple GPA’s w/ Kantara),

Have just read the operating procedures the Secretary, if I remember, keeps track of documents at what phase distributed in what manner and where appropriate, to whom.

From: LC [mailto:lc-bounces at kantarainitiative.org<mailto:lc-bounces at kantarainitiative.org>] On Behalf Of Colin Wallis
Sent: Wednesday, February 28, 2018 5:58 AM
To: Kantara Leadership Council <lc at kantarainitiative.org<mailto:lc at kantarainitiative.org>>
Cc: Ruth Puente <ruth at kantarainitiative.org<mailto:ruth at kantarainitiative.org>>; Oliver Maerz <oliver at kantarainitiative.org<mailto:oliver at kantarainitiative.org>>

Subject: [KI-LC] Download form turned into a GPA - what do you think?

Folks

A couple of things have prompted me to think about this.

1) the new Ops Procs draft where we are being clearer about the process if someone deploys a Kantara Tec Spec but is not in conformance with the normative requirements and

2) Ruth and Oliver working on a way to manage the 800-63-3 SACs spreadsheet available for download to 'members only'.

In an effort to bind the downloader into the Kantara WG that produced the publication, I thought we could have them sign the GPA and join that Group.

Chairs would have to be stricter on those that chose to be voting members, to reclassify them etc, but the effect of having downloaders GPA'd into the Group has some positive downstream effects in terms of keeping in touch with potential deployers etc etc.

What do you think?

Cheers
Colin

Executive Director
Cell: +44 (0)7490 266 778<tel:+44%207490%20266778>
@KantaraColin

Kantara Consent Receipt and UMA are 2 of the top 5<https://identiverse.com/2017/12/18/five-identity-trends-watch-2018/>
See Kantara's 2017 Great Work!<https://kantarainitiative.org/confluence/pages/viewpage.action?pageId=96437567>
Kantara Initiative Inc<https://kantarainitiative.org/> & Kantara Initiative, Europe
[https://drive.google.com/uc?id=0B7y8c3lrgRtUUjRFMHFMQm1BR3M&export=download]

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Andrew Hughes CISM CISSP
Independent Consultant
In Turn Information Management Consulting

o  +1 650.209.7542<tel:(650)%20209-7542>
m +1 250.888.9474<tel:(250)%20888-9474>
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Victoria, BC V8P 2H8<https://maps.google.com/?q=1249+Palmer+Road,+Victoria,+BC+V8P+2H8&entry=gmail&source=g>
AndrewHughes3000 at gmail.com<mailto:AndrewHughes3000 at gmail.com>
ca.linkedin.com/pub/andrew-hughes/a/58/682/<http://ca.linkedin.com/pub/andrew-hughes/a/58/682/>
Identity Management | IT Governance | Information Security

--

Andrew Hughes CISM CISSP
Independent Consultant
In Turn Information Management Consulting

o  +1 650.209.7542<tel:(650)%20209-7542>
m +1 250.888.9474<tel:(250)%20888-9474>
1249 Palmer Road,<https://maps.google.com/?q=1249+Palmer+Road,+Victoria,+BC+V8P+2H8&entry=gmail&source=g>
Victoria, BC V8P 2H8<https://maps.google.com/?q=1249+Palmer+Road,+Victoria,+BC+V8P+2H8&entry=gmail&source=g>
AndrewHughes3000 at gmail.com
ca.linkedin.com/pub/andrew-hughes/a/58/682/
Identity Management | IT Governance | Information Security

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